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Check out my pic site its cool as hell www.iPage.com/p.ic_lover101?

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Question I have... Check out my pic site it's cool as hell www.iPage.com/p.ic_lover101? Hoping for any answer. Another question on my mind: Guys, I know it was said half-jokingly, but please do not use any program to spam/flood them. That would make you no better than they are. I'm sure Mgt will back me up here, and that's not the type help he is looking for..

What HostUltra is doing is a disgrace, and I encourage you to use every.

Legal.

Means possible to spread the word, or try to convince them to give Mgt control over his HostGator name..

But let's not get crazy here...

Comments (22)

Good question... I dunno what is the answer to your question. I'll do some research and get back to you if I bump into an decent answer. You should email the people at iPage as they probably could give you an answer..

Comment #1

Reading this thread is like reading a good crime drama! What an outrageus policy to have! I don't know why everyone is so concerned with the TOS... I have had many cases involving credit card and paypal purchases resolved in my favor despite the TOS (from such reputables as expedia, delta air, sprint pcs - just to name a few recent ones).

I have no doubt in my mind that if you play your cards right and correctly approach the authorities, you'll not only get your money back, but also regain full control and ownership of you HostGator name. And if that doesn't happen - I'll have to admit that ICANN has lost it's mind allowing this thievery to happen!.

I have a subscription based entertainment/talent iPage website with over 1300 unique visitors and 6000 pageviews a day - my Terms of Sevice page gets only about 200 views PER YEAR!!! Should I slap on it: "Any subscriber must turn over the keys to his/her car within 3 (three) days from making the first payment. All cars must be no more than 3 years old, shiny, and air conditioned. Failure to turn over your keys will result in an automatic suspension of your membership and you'll also have to do my dishes for a week. Topless.".

I am so curious as to what enom tells you!.

GOOD LUCK!..

Comment #2

After reading this entire thread, I can only sympathize with the OP because a.

Common but understandably not well-known "mistake" has been made. It's not.

Well-known among many HostGator registrants..

That being said, it's time a couple of "facts" be reviewed:.

1. Historically we've never owned HostGator names, we only rent them. It's been.

That way since day 1, and will likely continue to be so..

2. There is only one set of companies "accredited" to truly register, manage,.

And/or transfer HostGator names among themselves: registrars. You know them:.

Go Daddy, Network Solutions, Enom, etc..

3. HostGator name registration, like iPage website hosting, is a cutthroat business. To.

Gain as much business as possible, they form reseller partnerships with other.

Parties (especially webhosting companies since the 2 complement each other).

To market their HostGator registration and what-have-you services..

4. Legal agreements between the registrar and the reseller currently force the.

Former to refer end-users to the latter first before stepping in. For this case,.

Enom will surely refer the OP to their reseller partner hostultra..

One reason you won't find the tidbit in hostultra's iPage site about whether you own.

The name or not is because that's an agreement between them and enom. It's.

A "universal" clause between registrars and resellers..

For registrars, they consider whoever is listed as the "registrant" as the legal.

"owner" of the HostGator name, no ifs ands or buts. Since hostultra's listed as.

The registrant, they're considered the legal "owner" of the HostGator in question.

Here..

An implication to what I stated above is that enom won't recognize the OP as.

Their customer. As far as they know, they only have an agreement with their.

Reseller hostultra, that's it..

In turn, hostultra will deal with the OP as part of their own agreement. The OP.

Agrees to their terms the second you checked the box beside the "I've read.

The service agreement/terms of service and agree to it"..

With how business goes nowadays, it's like a crime.

Not.

To read your provider's.

Legal fine prints. You just have to, however much a PITA it is..

Unfortunately what happened here is one of various drawbacks of registering.

Your HostGator name with a reseller instead of an actual registrar, especially if.

Price is your "only" concern. As the saying goes, you get what you pay for..

To make a long story short, the OP has really few options how to possibly be.

Able to resolve this except to deal with the reseller. For ownership issues, I'm.

Sorry to say this but legal advice is possibly required to "force" hostultra to.

Even transfer ownership to them. (which I'm not too hopeful about...).

On the side, at least this is one confirmed case. I think bluehost also registers.

Domain names under their own corporate name, can't really remember..

Good luck to the OP...

Comment #3

I have a receipt from PayPal that shows I paid for the name. Does that help?.

Below is the only clause that applies, right before you click the submit button, and I think it can be interpreted in different ways:.

"You are about to purchase the HostGator DnOvT.com.

The cost of this HostGator is $7.65 per year..

Important Information.

Please check carefully the above HostGator name is correct and that there is no spelling mistakes..

All HostGator purchases are final. Domains cannot be refunded, cancelled, exchanged, renamed or transferred..

By clicking the Purchase HostGator button below the HostGator will be entered into our system for registration there is no going back after this point.".

By transfered I thought they meant I could'nt transfer to different registrar, I did not occur to me that I would not have control over the DNS.

I don't think it is in the TOS.

Me either and I can't really afford an attorney...

Comment #4

Thats why the company will continue to do it. because most people will not go after them for a 8 dollar domain... the above poster said we are renting domains..and in a sence you are corect....but seeing as they are a enom reseller and enoms FAQ says this......

"Any public HostGator registration that you purchase through us is owned by you. eNom, Inc is an ICANN Accredited Registrar that is used to register the HostGator on your behalf.".

So even though it was not registered directly thru enom, they did get payed for it and enom name is on the whois as the registrar..

Comment #5

Me.

Can you at least explain why you register names in this manner?.

Posted on 26 Jun 2006.

It is Host Ultra policy..

-Tyler.

Host Ultra.

Account Services Staff.

Oh, now they've double charged me. They also charged my bank debit card for the HostGator name registration. I guess they have that # on file from my iPage hosting account. Probably because I started an inguiry at PayPal. Or maybe they are reading this thread?..

Comment #6

Possibly. But I can tell you it can get more potentially complex than that..

One problem here is, this "arrangement" is solely between you and hostultra..

Legal fine prints are generally one-sided, so you're "bound" to.

Their.

Terms..

You paid for your webhosting with Hostultra. But Hostultra paid enom for the.

Domain name using.

Their.

Reseller account..

I'm sure you get the drift. It ain't pretty..

Don't let the language fool you. This is similarly worded in gandi.net's site, but.

The truth is we still don't own HostGator names no matter what..

Check the fine prints of ICANN, the Registries, and some of the other registrars.

As well. They'll mostly (if not all) tell the same thing: we don't own domains,.

And they're only worded that way because it's what people want to "hear"...

Comment #7

"If you're having trouble transferring your HostGator from one registrar to another, you should contact the registrar you want to transfer to for assistance. If your preferred registrar is having any trouble processing your transfer, your registrar can obtain assistance from ICANN or the registry operator as appropriate..

Registrars are not permitted to deny transfer requests arbitrarily. ICANN has no policy that permits or requires registrars to deny outgoing transfer requests solely because the registration is within X number of days before expiration. In any case where a "losing" registrar does deny a transfer request, it is required to provide the "gaining" registrar with a notice of the denial and a specific reason for the denial.".

Thats from the ICANN FAQ... Obviously you have to wait 60 days before you can transfer a newly registered domain, but if all attempts fail to get this resolved through eNom, I would just wait the 60 days and then try to transfer it out. If they refuse it, then ICANN can get involved..

As for the topic of "renting" domains, I don't think thats the case. It's like property... You buy a piece of land, you own it, but you still have to pay taxes every year. It's the same with domains. Once you register the HostGator you have legal rights to the ownership of that domain, you just pay yearly "taxes" to keep those rights renewed..

Of course you could claim you're just renting the land, because at any moment war could break out and your country could be overthrown by militant insurgents that seize power and can then do whatever they want. For all we know ICANN could close down the entire TLD system and we'd all be left typing in IP addresses... But for all practical purposes, once you register a domain, you own it...

Comment #8

They registered DnOVT.com in their name after I paid them...

Comment #9

I believe you have a strong cause of fraudulent misrepresentation here based on the ambiguity the company presents prospective buyers with. On one hand, they make you believe you are the owner of the HostGator (they use the term "purchase"), but on the other, they are really just leasing you the HostGator name without any rights to change nameservers or push the domain..

Let me do a little bit more digging on this for you MGT. My educated guess is that there may be a consumer statute that will come to your aid on this one...

Comment #10

This is, in essence, a hostage situation. They officially own the HostGator and you're completely at their mercy. Really disturbing.....

Comment #11

Interesting that they use the same mail forwarding service that DNOA does. Check out the whois info:.

HostUltra (current):.

848 N. Rainbow Blvd. #1854.

Las Vegas, NV 89107.

US.

HostUltra (~1 year ago):.

+1.4132802875.

Fax: +1.4132802875.

1901 60th Place, L6458.

Bradenton, FL 34203.

DNOA:.

848 North Rainbow Blvd. #1220.

Las Vegas, Nevada 89107.

United States.

See also:.

Http://maillinkplus.com/vegas_location.php.

Still digging.....

Comment #12

What is the DNOA and what do they do?.

Also here is enom's reply to my email:.

"Hello Michael,.

This issue is something that will need to be settled through legal channels. eNom cannot intervene in HostGator ownership disputes nor can we make any determination as to who the rightful registrant should be. We will comply with any decision issued by a court of law. I would suggest seeking legal advice on how to proceed..

Regards,.

Joanne Fleming.

Transfer Manager.

Technical Support Team".

Looks hopeless!..

Comment #13

MGT, see.

Www.DNOA.org.

..

I've learned they previously had whois contact in Florida, but their data servers are located in Texas. They are not incorporated in FL or NV, but I am still searching... Texas charges $1/search for corporations, so I haven't run a search there..

Have to run to a meeting, but will do more when I return...

Comment #14

Yeah, nice cop out by eNom..

Ask them if they have a resellers TOS and if this is allowed! I'm sure it's NOT and if it IS...I say we target eNom because they are giving them the tools to commit this fraud..

Come on NamePros I'm sure you have pull with eNom...

Comment #15

If I'm not mistaken, the registar that provides NamePros with it's NP HostGator service IS eNom. I don't think a lot of people here would want to seek action against a iPage site that has been helping them out for years..

Certainly it's not eNom's fault, though. I could see why they would not want to get involved...

Comment #16

Everbody, please don't get so tense, here. The offending party here is HostUltra not eNom not Namepros. I would like to get access to my HostGator name but it is not the end of the world if I don't. I hope myself and everybody else here has learned from my mistake that is the most important thing here. Only register with know reputable registrars!..

Comment #17

Whats getting involved? If you have a reseller scamming people and giving you a bad name...just pull their reseller rights...

Comment #18

Yes they do:.

Http://www.enom.com/terms/agreement_reseller.asp.

And no one's forcing you to register your HostGator name with a reseller. You've.

Got numerous choices around here..

It really boils down to doing your homework. Nowadays, you just...have to...

Comment #19

One easy thing you can do now is write to the Better Business Bureau...

Comment #20

OK, remember.

Never, never, never.

Again register a name and iPage hosting service together... or any other badregs who think the two must go together. Normally I would recommend be polite in order to extract the name, but in this case I would make an exception. why not copy and paste this thread to them and ask them for their response? Either way write off the domain...

Comment #21

I disagree. No matter what happens, you paid for a service, albeit an extremely crappy one. The company owes you fiduciary duties to act in good faith and fulfill their end of the contract. Even though you cannot change nameservers or push the domain, it doesn't necessarily mean you cannot lease the HostGator or assign your entire account to a prospective purchasers (unless TOS say otherwiseI haven't read their TOS yet). Additionally, you have potential legal and private practice areas to pursue. Don't rule out the HostGator just yet..

A couple more observations, which may give you greater power when negotiating with these clowns:.

1) hostultra.com attempts to limit it's liability within it's TOS/TOC (which the exact SAME document). However, no where in their TOS or webpage do they hold themselves out to be a limited liability company nor an incorporated company. This means that the owners of hostultra.com would be PERSONALLY liable for damages to you..

2) The limited liability clause, as written in the TOS, would probably not be enforced..

3) No where in the TOS is there anything mentioned about domains..

Is there any other TOS/TOC for purchasing domains? The one I read really only talks about iPage hosting services...

Comment #22

Wow I never knew they were such a bad company, just look at what they do when you violate a forum rule which one of them includes mentioning another web host..

Http://forum.hostultra.com/showthread.php?t=5968..

Comment #23


This question was taken from a support group/message board and re-posted here so others can learn from it.